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In-progress Highway Systems & Work / Re: usatr: United States select tourist routes
« Last post by mapcat on April 14, 2024, 07:51:25 pm »
Can we make the Select systems a separate category in the stats, like we do with active vs active+preview? Preview will go away, eventually, and we could adjust the column titles to something like "Defined" and "Defined+Select". People who want to get 100% on official, government-defined systems could use the left column as their benchmark, and those who are more interested in maximizing their total driving mileage could use the right column. "Select" systems naturally will have more frequent changes, as those doing the selecting adjust their thinking on things they were on the fence about. Can't speak for Valerie or Anthony here, but personally, I find it somewhat easier to accept losing a 100% clinch due to a new state highway being built than I do due to an entirely new class of routes being added, especially when the criteria for inclusion is subjective.

Please understand, I have nothing against what Si did by creating this set (which people have desired for quite some time). It's conceptually valid and a welcome addition to the site. But the discussion of what else might eventually be added causes me some stress, mostly from the extra work I'll need to do with maintaining poorly-signed and unclearly-defined routes in my regions.
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In-progress Highway Systems & Work / Re: usatr: United States select tourist routes
« Last post by Duke87 on April 14, 2024, 06:59:29 pm »
I agree in general that "it will cause someone to lose a 100% clinch" is not in and of itself a reason not to add something. But there are people who care about their 100% clinches, and it logically follows that if something is added that breaks one, they will feel obligated to go clinch it in order to get their 100% clinch back.

It isn't just vdeane either. I also care about my 100% clinches and would be lying if I said I wasn't relieved that usatr as it exists doesn't break any of them. Nonetheless, I already went through this problem with usanp. I had a 100% clinch of NJ that was broken by the addition of usanp routes in Delaware Water Gap NRA. You betcha I made a point of clinching those to get my 100% clinch back when I probably never would have otherwise. Fortunately this wasn't that big of a deal since they were routes that I regularly passed fairly near anyway so I didn't need to go that far out of my way for them. But, yes, the addition of something at the east end of Long Island would create a major headache for anyone who does not live in Long Island.
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Oregon Trail in Oregon:

exit 193 to exit 168: Echo Road, Thielsen Street, Oregon Trail Road, OR 207, Bombing Range Road all the way to I-84

exit 87 to Oregon City (Barlow Road Route): US 197 (including around Dufur), Tygh Valley Road, Wamic Market Road, NF 48, OR 35, Barlow Pass, OR 35, US 26 (can't find any signs at the old alignments), OR 211, OR 224, Bakers Ferry Road, Springwater Road, Hattan Road, Gronlund Road, Bradley Road, Holcomb Boulevard (this sign got turned around), Abernethy Road to end at Washington Street

Grass Valley (or farther east??) to Tygh Valley (Barlow Road Cutoff): OR 216 to the main Barlow Road at US 197
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In-progress Highway Systems & Work / Re: usatr: United States select tourist routes
« Last post by Jim on April 14, 2024, 06:00:58 pm »
A few quick thoughts:

- I agree that the New York Scenic Byways, if added, would make sense as something like usanysb, not part of usatr since they don't span multiple regions.
- The routes being poorly-defined would be a good reason not to add them.  They seem well signed in the places I've seen them, but I haven't been on all that many.  But if we'd have to be hunting for signs in person or on street view, that's not great.  The spurs don't sound fun, either.
- Causing people to lose 100% clinches in regions is not a good reason not to add something.  People have many reasons to plot their travels in TM.  Yes, some want to see 100% come up in the stats.  Others (like me) are more interested in tracking where I've been, and the more routes that make sense to be included, the happier I am.  The "I swear, if you make me drive all the way out to far eastern Long Island again" comment actually worries me.  I hope no one feels obligated to go anywhere they don't want to go just because a route is added to or is updated in this project.
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In-progress Highway Systems & Work / Re: usatr: United States select tourist routes
« Last post by Duke87 on April 14, 2024, 05:23:29 pm »
I noticed something interesting in Maryland on the National Road.  There's a point west of Baltimore where MD 144 ends in the middle of a National Road segment that doesn't have a point on the National Road.

It's a hidden point on NatRd, so concurrency detection will still work. This is because there's no intersection there, that section of MD 144 ends at the county line.

Quote
I thought this system was going to be mainly multi-state routes, not getting down into the weeds of what every state considers a scenic byway?

There is no officially defined scope at this point. I had suggested this upthread precisely because I don't like that level of getting down into the weeds either, but it is still open for discussion.
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In-progress Highway Systems & Work / Re: usatr: United States select tourist routes
« Last post by vdeane on April 14, 2024, 05:03:24 pm »
I noticed something interesting in Maryland on the National Road.  There's a point west of Baltimore where MD 144 ends in the middle of a National Road segment that doesn't have a point on the National Road.

I'd be interested to see what's not already covered from the routes in New York Scenic Byways: https://www.dot.ny.gov/display/programs/scenic-byways/lists

I'm guessing its going to be similar to what @neroute2 found for All-American Roads, that it would be almost all concurrent with routes we already have.


I thought this system was going to be mainly multi-state routes, not getting down into the weeds of what every state considers a scenic byway?  And unfortunately I'm unaware of any GIS-based map of these things that would make it easy to pin down exact alignments.  There's also the fact that many of these aren't traditional routes that go from point A to point B... they branch and have spurs all over the place (ugh).

There is a surprisingly large amount of scenic byway mileage in NY that isn't concurrent with the touring route system.  I swear, if you make me drive all the way out to far eastern Long Island again... looks like I'm losing my 100% of NY for the next several years at this rate.
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OH LinHwyAsh leaves US 42 thru Windsor (west end).
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LCT in West Point KY

It seems to simply use US 31W Bus thru town (south end).
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