NY: various state route changes

[Duke87]

Per vdeane at AARoads:

I checked the 2014 Traffic Data Report and NY 314 east of US 9, NY 22 north of US 11, NY 374 north of US 11, and the entirety of NY 456 are no longer listed.  Neither is NY 12E southeast of Paddy Hill Road, and reference route 971H (Paddy Hill Road) no longer appears either, suggesting that NY 12E now officially follows the signs in the area (Main Office Traffic and Safety had mentioned something about a jurisdictional transfer in that area when I asked about it, in the two out of infinity questions I was able to get through before the guy left; there's also something going on with NY 324 at the I-190 overlap, and a new revision of the touring route log is in the works).

Looks like the following changes are needed:
- truncate NY 22 from the border to US 11
- truncate NY 374 from the border to US 11
- delete NY 456
- reroute NY 12E to end at NY 12F in Paddy Hill rather than continuing into Watertown

HB already shows NY 324 overlapping I-190 as described, so no change needed there.

[yakra]

Adding this thread and a couple GitHub issues to my ToDo list.
Heading off to Kings County and such later today. Won't be able to make the changes for a week or so.

[vdeane]

Per vdeane at AARoads:

I checked the 2014 Traffic Data Report and NY 314 east of US 9, NY 22 north of US 11, NY 374 north of US 11, and the entirety of NY 456 are no longer listed.  Neither is NY 12E southeast of Paddy Hill Road, and reference route 971H (Paddy Hill Road) no longer appears either, suggesting that NY 12E now officially follows the signs in the area (Main Office Traffic and Safety had mentioned something about a jurisdictional transfer in that area when I asked about it, in the two out of infinity questions I was able to get through before the guy left; there's also something going on with NY 324 at the I-190 overlap, and a new revision of the touring route log is in the works).

Looks like the following changes are needed:
- truncate NY 22 from the border to US 11
- truncate NY 374 from the border to US 11
- delete NY 456
- reroute NY 12E to end at NY 12F in Paddy Hill rather than continuing into Watertown

HB already shows NY 324 overlapping I-190 as described, so no change needed there.

Don't forget "truncate NY 314 from the ferry to US 9".

[froggie]

Are we considering the traffic data report the end-all/be-all?  I, for one, find the NY 314 truncation doubtful, given the ferry is an interstate crossing.

(EDIT) As a follow up, I checked the 2014 Inventory Listings for the counties involved (accessible here).  The Inventory Listings show all four touring routes mentioned as still in-place as before, albeit now county maintained (and city of Watertown maintained for a stretch of NY 12E).  This may explain why they're not on the traffic data report.

I think we should wait and verify whether these route segments are unsigned before we take them off TM.  Though I believe I've seen a photo showing 374 signage changed to a county route north of 11.

[vdeane]

The changes are visible on street view.  On NY 314 EB, the end sign at US 9 is visible.  The photo for NY 374 is on AA Roads; it's also visible in street view both directions on US 11 (I don't think I've ever seen a NY 374 reassurance shield north of US 11; the county-only signage is nothing new).  Same for NY 22 - no signage north of US 11 (only indication at the west side of the overlap that NY 22 was ever there is a distance sign that wouldn't normally be on a local street), end sign south of US 11 visible in street view.  NY 12E can also be seen in street view - it's been signed that way for over a decade or two now; the 2014 Traffic Data Report is just the first NYSDOT report to acknowledge it.  Unfortunately, there's not really current street view of NY 456, but the imagery on I-87 north shows that the directional shields at the end of the ramp have been removed.

The traffic data report shows city/town/county maintained sections of state highway.

[froggie]

The traffic data report shows city/town/county maintained sections of state highway

So does the Inventory Listing, which is of the same year and tells me there's a discrepancy somewhere in NYSDOT's reporting.  They both can't be right.

[Duke87]

Don't forget "truncate NY 314 from the ferry to US 9".

Wait, the truncation is EAST of US 9!? Wow, 314 might now be NY's shortest signed state highway!

Anyway, is there not precedent for a route getting signage removed and such before DOT gets around to actually deleting it from the inventory? As much as we'd like the route inventory to be the definitive source it doesn't really function as such.

There has definitely been some deliberate removal of signage on the segments named, so given existing TM policy to not include unsigned routes...

[vdeane]

It doesn't beat NY 419, but it does edge out NY 437 for second.  Why not just make it a reference route if they were going to truncate it there (and yeah, I had to check the street view to believe it had been truncated).

There is the example of NY 590, which signage truncated to Titus Avenue upon the completion of the Sea Breeze Drive project, but which is still included in documentation like the Traffic Data Report.

[yakra]

https://github.com/TravelMapping/HighwayData/pull/544
That takes care of everything we need, right?